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Thanks Diane, for a moment there reading this i felt David was still with us. I feel David hit the nail on the head at the end of the article.Yes Joe may have done some unethical things in his life,he may have screwed some people in business and a host of other dirty business dealings.However when all is said and done,who of us has a clean slate? From my point of view Joe, and Hoffman too, laid the groundwork for the whole fitness industry and all of the offshoots we have today. Joe had a dream and took himself from rags to riches, but and this is the important thing, he never lost his love of bodybuilding and the related strength world.I feel on the balance a lot more people benefited from Joe's work than suffered,the same can be said of Hoffman.Just a pity they could not have worked together for the love of the game.I agree that the 1940s-1960s were the best years for Weider mags with Hovarth, Leiderman,Orlick and most of all Chas Smith as contributing writers.Others may choose to differ but just my opinion.Just to clarify one point that David only found out long after penning the article.He says Dan Lurie never paid him for his articles,however the truth is that Dan did pay but the money just did not get to David.The thing is David had written the articles in question for a British bodybuilding mag,which shall remain nameless, and the owner had sent the articles to Dan and received payment,but kept the money and David was non the wiser and blamed poor old Dan.